On SRman's Workbench

Discussion in 'Workshop Benches' started by SRman, Feb 27, 2016.

  1. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Some years ago I had the idea that I might build a Harry Potter-themed exhibition layout. With that in mind I bought one of the earlier Hornby Castle models (ex-Airfix, I think) of 5972, Hogwarts Castle. I know it should be a Hall, but at that time there were no "correct" models available commercially. I also bought four of the Hornby coaches to go with it, and converted two EFE RT/RTL models into the triple-decker bus. I collected a whole heap of Pringles tubes (after emptying them!), and various other smaller cardboard tubes to make the school. The layout never eventuated as I had enough to do building my existing layout!

    I have considered converting the locomotive to DCC but each time I opened it up to have a look, I put it into the 'too hard' basket and put it away again ... until now.This time I made a determined effort to fit a small TCS M1 decoder in. Being an early model, it isn't DCC-ready, so the decoder had to be hard-wired. That's not that difficult as the motor is already isolated from the chassis, although the electrical pickup arrangements leave a bit to be desired - that's something I'll improve in the near future. At present, it picks up from one side of the tender and the other side of the locomotive.

    The first photo shows the chassis with the TCS M1 decoder fitted and held lightly in place by Blu-Tack for testing purposes. A test on the programming track showed all should be well, so a quick run on the rolling road was done to prove the installation was good to go.

    [​IMG]

    To allow room for the decoder, I had to remove the solid weight from the boiler, but to compensate for the loss of traction weight, I added some thin lead sheet curved to fit into the smokebox and front part of the boiler while leaving the decoder space in front of the motor block. A strip of duct tape was added to insulate the lead from any electrical contacts and the decoder.

    However, I had decided that while I was about it, I would add a couple of YouChoos locomotive lamps on the front, and their orange SMD firebox glow in the cab. To complicate things, I decided that it would be best to add a 3-pin plug (also from YouChoos) to allow the body to be easily separated from the chassis for maintenance purposes while leaving the lights attached to the body.

    The next photos show the lamps and firebox LED tacked loosely in place in side the body. You can also see the lead sheet and tape at the top of the boiler. The wires were later shortened. The front lamp wires were threaded through the plastic footplate just behind where I wanted them, and then threaded through holes in the frames before going through another, larger hole in the bottom of the boiler, behind the smokebox. The tricky bit was threading the thin, and rather flexible wires along the inside of the boiler, but I eventually got them all through.

    The blue wires were all collected as a common return and soldered to the blue wire of the plug. Three resistors were soldered to a small segment of pcb, with the tracks cut through on each side of the resistors. The two white wires from the front lamps were soldered to individual resistors on the circuit board, visible in the third photo below, as was the orange wire from the firebox LED. This latter wire becomes the yellow wire from the decoder.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The firebox SMD was mounted into a hole drilled into the firebox door, and angled inwards to attempt to simulate the fire bed as it would be visible through the open door.

    [​IMG]

    I forgot to take photos of the plug wiring, but it all went together well and fitted neatly (well, fitted, anyway!) inside. The decoder was fixed down with double-sided tape, rather than the temporary Blu-Tack used earlier.

    Here is the loco on test on the layout. At present, because I have used a TCS M1 I am limited to using the white and yellow wires (there are only two functions available), by default the front lamps light up when going forwards and the firebox lights up in reverse! A simple bit of reprogramming will allow both to be on regardless of direction, although I am going to see if I can remap the firebox one (yellow wire) to function 1, then program a flicker into it.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Even as it stands now, I think I have succeeded in what I set out to do. It merely needs a couple of minor adjustments and improvements to the locomotives track pickups to complete the project.
     
  2. Gary

    Gary Wants more time for modelling.... Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    7,338
    Likes Received:
    3,883
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2015
    Your a braver man than I am Jeff ! The lights look great, but like you said, with a little programming you should get the desired results your after. :thumbup:

    Looks simple enough but I don't think I have the necessary skills to do such a job, yet... (I'm using the Toto approach here !:avatar:) Maybe one day I could tackle a similar project... :scratchchin:

    Cheers, Gary.
     
  3. ianvolvo46

    ianvolvo46 Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    5,351
    Likes Received:
    1,616
    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2015
    Really impressed with what you achieved Jeff who knows one day ....

    Ian
     
  4. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Thanks, guys. I have posted links to a couple of videos in my layout topic, now that this model is all but complete.
     
  5. Toto

    Toto I'm best ignored Staff Member Founder Administrator

    Messages:
    15,419
    Likes Received:
    3,842
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2017
    Very impressive. The fire box lights make the difference and once flickering ..... Well .... I think will be the bees knees.

    As Gary said .... A brave man but just shows it can be done. :thumbs:
     
  6. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Some years ago, I decided to try and improve the running qualities of one of my Lima class 73 models by replacing the Lima armature with a ModelTorque motor (available from the manufacturer just a couple of kilometres up the road from me at the time - sadly no longer available since the passing of the man responsible for them). This was almost a drop-in replacement but promised much better, smoother and more responsive running. It still used the Lima gearing and did deliver what was promised, although the Lima gearing did it no favours, but it would go from a crawl to around 350 mph. The top speed was later tamed a little with a diode pack supplied by the manufacturer. At this time I was still using analogue DC.

    It was still totally dependent on the Lima brass wheels and dodgy electrical pickups, however. That remained the achilles heel for running qualities. Hard-wiring a Bachmann decoder allowed much finer tuning for the motor speeds and also tamed the acceleration and deceleration using the inertia/momentum settings, but still those brass weheels and poor electrical characteristics prevented reliable running, with the occasional prod from a large finger being needed.

    A partial solution has since become available in the form of a Hornby dummy bogie from Peter's Spares. The Hornby bogie not only has better wheels but also picks up from both sides of the bogie, where the Lima one only picked up from one side. Fitting the bogie required the hole in the chassis for the original Lima one to be enlarged a little, using a round file. The Hornby bogie could then be clipped in, after first threading the two wires through. When I originally rewired the Lima chassis for DCC, I followed the convention of using a red wire for the right-hand track feed from the power bogie (which is always the number 2 end of the Lima/Hornby models). Hornby have very kindly marked one of the two black wires from the new bogie with a red patch - this also goes to the right-hand side of the bogie. I simply soldered the red-patch wire to my existing red connections, and the black wires together, then tested for short-circuits before putting the loco on the programming track and double-checking that all was well.

    Doing this modification means that I have electrical pickup from four decent quality wheels on the dummy bogie, and two (on one side only) through the Lima brass driven wheels. I could wire up extra pickups for the remaining two wheels on the motor bogie but these also have traction tyres, so the benefit would be marginal, to say the least. Anyway, the running, while not perfect, has improved considerably, to the point where 73 142, Broadlands, can now rejoin the main fleet and not be parked languishing at the back of the drawer.

    In the photos, the motor bogie looks like it has a standard Lima 'pancake' motor, whereas, in fact, the ModelTorque motor is installed from the other side, away from the camera. The first photo shows the new bogie clipped in place after opening out the hole, with the two wires floating loose, and the original Lima clip arrangement also detached, awaiting removal.

    [​IMG]

    The second photo shows everything soldered in place and all joints covered with heat-shrink tubing. I had to use a short stretch of red decoder wire to extend the reach of the Hornby wire to the original wiring.

    [​IMG]

    Here's a short video to how the improved running and controllability. It's by no means perfect, but it is much better than it was.

    https://youtu.be/Un_HQ-BfDuE

    I may have to consider putting a newer, better decoder ... I'm not even certain that the existing one has BEMF facilities, it's that old!
     
  7. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    I bit the bullet and took the old decoder out, and added a Lenz Standard+ v.2 in its place. This decoder has improved the running out of sight, although it looks like I'll have to add an extra resistance into the line, as even on the lowest settings, the locomotive jumps forwards. The running itself is now extremely steady, so having BEMF controls seems to be part of the answer with this motor.

    I used JMRI Decoder Pro to create a speed table and limit the top speed to something reasonable (the real locomotives had an official top speed of 90 mph, although at least two have been clocked at 107 mph on the Bournemouth line).

    There is more to do, but I am now pretty happy with the quality of the running of this locomotive.

    I have been progressively fitting etched nameplates to all of my locomotives, but Broadlands has eluded me as none of the plate manufacturers that I can deal with from here in Australia seem to offer them.
     
  8. Toto

    Toto I'm best ignored Staff Member Founder Administrator

    Messages:
    15,419
    Likes Received:
    3,842
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2017
    Maybe Broadlands is something that can be aquired over here. a bit of mooching needed maybe.:avatar:
     
  9. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    On that theme, a simple task (albeit, requiring steady hands) is to fit further etched nameplates to a few more locomotives.

    Two more of my class 73s have now had the printed plates covered with proper etched versions: 73 004, The Bluebell Railway, and 73 129, City of Winchester, both look much better now with their Fox Transfers etched stainless steel plates. Both are on Hornby chassis, but 73 004 has a Lima body. I mix and match bodies on the Hornby chassis - I have eight of the chassis but around 12 bodies of both Lima and Hornby origins.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    A banger blue Heljan class 47 also got the treatment. 47 508, S. S. Great Britain, now sports the Fox plates.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  10. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    A while ago, I bought a second bargain Bachmann class 350/1 unit, and some more of the Electra Railway Graphics class 450 vinyl overlays, with the alternate unit number, with a view to eventually running an 8-car South West Trains composed of my existing conversion, 450 107, and the new one, which will be 450 084.

    Both units are fitted with ESU LokSound decoders with Legomanbiffo's class 350 sounds adapted slightly to eliminate the pantograph air compressor start up sounds (the 450s don't have pantographs!).

    Taking advantage of being on school holidays for the term break, and with lessons learnt from the first unit, I decided to roughly paint the new unit to reduce any livery show-through from the basic light grey and blue livery of the 350, through the vinyl overlays. I used a Humbrol matte dark blue (Oxford Blue, I think) as a basic body colour, and pre-painted the red and orange swoops and red doors. None of this had to be done with any great accuracy, but it doesn't look too bad even before adding any vinyls! I re-did the pointy ends of the swoops on the earlier unit to match photos of the real ones, as the vinyls weren't entirely accurate going around the cab fronts. The roofs, coach ends and lower edges of the tumblehomes were all then painted with First Bus 'Barbie Blue', which is a close (but not identical) match to the SWT blue on the vinyls - it is a shade darker, but even where this shows on the roofs, it doesn't look out of place because the real units' roofs weather to both darker and lighter shades than the sides.

    The first photo shows the previous unit before much painting had occurred, to show the original Silverlink livery.

    [​IMG]

    The next two photos show this intermediate stage on my workbench.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Finally, for this report, I posed the two units on my yet to be completed viaducts just to gauge the overall effect of running the two units together.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The next stage is to add the vinyls. It isn't really possible to show pictures of the vinyls being applied as I need both hands to ensure they go on straight and without any air bubbles. I'll post pics of the finished results, though.

    In case anyone is wondering why I don't just paint the units fully (I am capable of doing a reasonable job!), the vinyl overlays take care of all the SWT insignia, numbering and stripes, window and door markings and labels, and all those other tricky little details.
     
  11. Toto

    Toto I'm best ignored Staff Member Founder Administrator

    Messages:
    15,419
    Likes Received:
    3,842
    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2017
    They look well finished. How many units in total did you do. It looks like a looooooooong train.:avatar:

    Maybe a video when you are done:thumbs:

    Cheers .... Great as always.

    Toto
     
  12. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Tom, there are two 4-car units here. I have some video already of unit 450 107 running, both with and without sound. I will definitely do one of the pair together.

    Both have Legomanbiffo sound, but at present, one unit has a LokSound v3.5 and the other has a v4 decoder. I have speed matched them but they still don't match exactly. To get over this, I am getting a series of reblows from 'Bif, so that both 450 units end up with identical v3.5 decoders, while the v4 decoder will become a class 71 electric locomotive, ready for the arrival of the DJM models, which are due in the next month or two, according to some sources.

    I will be adding the vinyls to 450 084 in the next day or two, depending on the red paint drying properly (unfortunately, it's one of those rogue tins of paint that take an age to lose the tackiness, no matter how well mixed they are).
     
  13. Keith M

    Keith M Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    4,458
    Likes Received:
    2,911
    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2015
    Not heard any news recently regarding arrival of the DJM Class 71's from Kernow. I get the Kernow weekly newsletter, Hattons too, but presently it's "All quiet on the Western Front!" Hattons "Golden Arrow" version was promised for October, but since we're getting near the end of September and nothing on the horizon from Kernow (which I would assume would be the first to arrive as they commissioned them in the first place), that seems to be less likely now. Having seen the samples Dave jones was showing at the Loughborough event, (Dave said back then "A couple of months") they'll be well worth waiting for, and head and shoulders above the Hornby version, but I'm still itching for them to arrive. I'll be heading for Legomanbiffo's stand if they're at Warley in November, but just hoping that by then, I'll actually have a loco or two to fit sound into!
    Keith.
     
  14. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Just a quick, slightly fuzzy photo of the unit with the side vinyls added, but still some things to add and touch up. To be honest, I don't think I have done quite such a good job with the vinyls on this unit as I did with 450 107. Still, they really only have to pass muster at normal viewing distances.

    [​IMG]

    I had a message from Bif saying he would be away for the weekend, recording a class 47. That could be interesting!
     
  15. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    I have combined the two class 450 units as a DCC consist for a quick test of the two units in multiple. They aren't well matched, presently, because one has a v 3.5 decoder while the other has a v 4 version. I have a series of reblows in progress that will end up with both 450s having v 3.5 decoders, while the v 4 decoder will go to a new DJM class 71.

    I took a panoramic shot showing the two units posed on the viaducts, then a few short video clips of them in motion.

    [​IMG]

     
  16. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    The class 450 redecoration continues:

    The roof 'swoops' in red and orange have been added, as have various destination blind vinyls - Waterloo at one end and Southampton at the other, repeated at the trailing end side windows of the Driving Motor cars. I can live with the compromise of having two different destinations showing from the sides at different ends.

    The swoops need a little adjustment to tidy up the slight mismatch where the sides join the roofs, and, like the previous unit, the cab end stripes need careful adjustment and a little hand-painting to get them right. I hand-painted the black upper halves of the corridor end doors on the cab ends of the previous unit, rather than using the vinyls, and I think I'll do the same with this on as well. The vinyl unit numbers have also been applied, confirming the unit's identity as 450 084.

    Another trick with these vinyl overlays where they have to wrap around corners or be settled over raised detail is to use a hair dryer to heat them. This softens the vinyl and makes it a lot more malleable. I now have singed finger tips, but the vinyls are sitting a little more snugly over some of the details, particularly on the roofs.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    In the meantime, while awaiting paint drying and vinyls settling on the 450, I was giving one of my oldest class 73 models a run, and noticed how crappy my painting of the roof grilles for the electrical compartments was. I had weathered them early on, but never tidied it up, so the grilles were indistinct and just a grey-black blur.

    Now the Lima class 73 body mouldings have some of the finest moulded grilles you'll find anywhere. So fine that, with carefull painting, they can actually look better than etched see-through grilles, such as those on the much newer Dapol class 73, or Heljans newer class 33/0 efforts. All I needed to do in E6002's case was to dry brush some roof grey over the grille mesh and surrounds to tidy them up to my satisfaction.

    E6002 actually needs to be renumbered to one of E6004 to E 6006, or else I need to replace the buffers with oval ones, as sported by E6001 to E6003 when new. I think the round buffers were fitted at the same time as the first three went into BR blue.

    E6002 started life as a Lima model of 73 005 in BR large logo blue livery. Unfortunately, while all the livery elements were nicely done, the blue had a surface finish like fairly coarse sandpaper. I repainted the loco into green with grey roof and skirts. Much more recently, E6002 was the first of my Lima models to receive a Hornby DCC-ready chassis, from one of Hatton's bargain-priced class 73 models in Dutch livery (I bought several more of the Dutch model to re-chassis some other Lima 73s as well, over a period of months).

    Next, it received Howes' class 73 sounds on a LokSound v 3.5 decoder, fitted with a large, bass reflex speaker and a standard 23mm round speaker in parallel.

    When taking the photos, I realised that the replacement Hornby chassis still had black buffer beams, so they have had a coat of red in the last photo only.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  17. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Having mentioned the wrong buffers for the locomotive number, I decided it would be easier to swap the buffers than to renumber E6002. I had some rather nice brass oval buffers in my bits boxes, so removed the Hornby round buffers (they were a good force fit only) and glued the replacements in, then painted them. The paint is still wet in the second pic.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  18. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Another class 73 has now received etched name plates and shields. This time, it is royal locomotive, 73 142 Broadlands, with Shawplan plates. The locomotive has a Lima body and chassis, with a Modeltorque motor replacing the Lima 'pancake', and the addition of a newer Hornby unpowered bogie with its better wheels, extra pickups and NEM coupling pocket.

    I removed the printed Lima name plates and shields using a trick I learnt a long time ago: stick some sticky tape over the printed elements and press it on very, very firmly with a fingernail, then peel it off complete with the Lima transfers.

    I roughened the backs of the etched items then used some Krystal Klear glazing medium as a glue - any that squeezes out can be wiped off with a damp cloth.

    Not the best photo with limited light available, but here it is.

    [​IMG]

    And still on Lima class 73s, E6012 in early blue has a Lima body on a Hornby chassis. It also has legomanbiffo sound fitted. I tidied the roof grilles up, much as I did with green E6002 before. Once again, this emphasises just how fine the original Lima moulding was - pity about the mechanisms!

    [​IMG]
     
  19. SMR CHRIS

    SMR CHRIS Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    3,323
    Likes Received:
    545
    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2015
    Nice job on the Locos
    The new name plates and shields really do look good.:thumbs:
     
  20. SRman

    SRman Full Member

    Messages:
    895
    Likes Received:
    429
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Having played around with my early issue Hornby Hogwarts Castle by converting it to DCC and adding headlamps and flickering firebox glow, plus a crew, I was less than satisfied with the running qualities of the Airfix-derived chassis.

    Someone on one of the forums mentioned that the newest Hornby RailRoad County 4-6-0 chassis would be a good DCC-ready substitute, so I duly ordered one from Rails of Sheffield.

    The wheelbase is spot on, but on comparison of the two chassis side by side, I discovered that there are several discrepancies that would make the swap slightly more difficult, with the two major problems being the cylinder positions and the position of the rear combined tender drawbar and body mounting screw, which was slightly further forward on the County.

    After much head scratching, I decided that using the cylinders in the position of the County would be better as it more closely resembles that of a Hall, which is what the 'real' Hogwarts Castle is (Hornby didn't have a Hall model at the time, so used the Castle). I had already worked out that the chassis differences would not allow for an easy swap of cylinders and connecting rods. Allowing for the cylinders to fit under the Castle body meant filing down the depth of the footplate towards the front, which means that my Hogwarts Castle now has a shallow valance extending back to where the old cylinders sat. The repositioning of the cylinders also meant the 'S' shaped steam pipes were now leading from the smokebox to empty air, so they had to come off too; fortunately, they are separate mouldings which plug into holes in the smokebox and footplate.

    In the meantime, I pulled the TCS M1 decoder back out of the old chassis and resoldered the main track pickup wires (black and red) and the brush feed wires (grey and orange) back onto an 8-pin plug, but left the white, yellow and blue wires from the decoder soldered to the 3-pin connector plug I used to allow separation of the body from the chassis before. A quick test of the chassis showed that this was all successful.

    Back to the adaptation, I decided that the tender coupling should remain where it was on the Castle body, which meant that it didn't line up with the hole at the rear of the County chassis; I milled away a crescent shape at the rear of the metal County chassis to clear the screw while allowing it to set the chassis height at the rear, being hard against the rear of the chassis. The front mounting screw actually does most of the work of securing the chassis to the body.

    A few minor adjustments to the footplate, mainly involving drilling holes to clear bits of the County cylinders and valve gear, saw everything sitting nicely and running well.In all of this, I managed to dislodge the Hogwarts Express headboard, one of the headlamps, and the fireman I had previously glued in, so a quick session with the superglue saw all of those things restored to their 'correct' positions. I found some plastic tubing that was approximately the right diameter for some new straight steam pipes (maybe a teensy bit anaemic!), so set about trimming and fitting those by trial and error.

    I'm not too worried about accuracy: we are talking about a fictional engine on a fictional train, running on a fictional line from a fictional platform at Kings Cross to a fictional destination! With that in mind, a hybrid locomotive with an identity crisis really fits in! Poor old Hogwarts Castle doesn't know whether it is a Castle, a Hall or a County! [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Here are a couple of photos of it with the County chassis fitted but minus its headboard and steam pipes, no fireman, and with one headlamp pointing off into the scenery.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And after the fixes were applied.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    For anyone interested, the Knight Bus is one I hacked from two EFE models bought cheaply with the conversion in mind.

    I think I'm happy with it now, although I may restore the valance depth a little behind the cylinders at a later date ... much, much later.
     

Share This Page