Spring Time - Printing Time

Discussion in 'Kits, Kit bashes & Scratch builds' started by Mossy, Apr 25, 2022.

  1. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    New Day New Wagon

    The D1 - D2 was the first wagon I created using Fusion 360, in fact the first wagon using any CAD software. I have a couple of prints of that original design.
    Since then I have completely revamped the design and this is the first print of the new design:

    IMG_0948 (2).jpg

    What's happened to the K1, well print 2 was produced yesterday and didn't pass my qc criteria. It is going to be print at 45 by 45 degrees, if/when I get a working Mono X as it won't fit on my Mono build plate so for now on the back burner.

    Mossy
     
  2. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Mossy

    That print is impressive.

    Now for the Mono X

    Try creating a 30 x 30 x 5 block, add it to chitu box make 4 copies, and 1 in the center, the others at each corner.
    No supports - print direct to build plate. Try 8 base layers

    Before printing, usual level and zero the build plate, clean FEP and build plate with IPA , then Acetone then IPA again.

    Print - and what are the results ?

    Paul
     
  3. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Paul

    How do you set chitu up to print direct onto the build plate?

    Sorry another question, I'm 99.9% certain I put the new mono plate in the right way around, but what would be the effect of it being upside down?
     
  4. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Your going to kick yourself on this on

    In Chitubox

    Rotate the model into the position you want

    Then in the Move menu - select Put on plate

    upload_2022-4-28_14-43-13.png

    Now just click on slice

    Told you this one was easy :avatar:just miss out the support stage. If you have already gone to the support stage - remove all supports, then redo the Put on Plate stage from the move menu.

    Paul
     
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  5. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Cheers mate wouldn't have though of that! :facepalm:
     
  6. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Mr Dundee,

    oh have I had some fun and would really appreciate your answers (if you can think of any).

    First up I followed you destructions to the absolute letter up to the point where you state "print it".
    Firstly the .pmwx file was called cubes, it appeared on the control panel without a picture and when I tried to print it got the message "can't open the file"
    back down to the pc thinking I had Chitu set to Mono not Mono X. Wrong it's set to mono X, so I deleted and recreated it, back to the printer "can't open the file".
    I then decided to create the file using Photon Workshop double checking I was using Mono X settings "cant open the file", back to the pc to recreate it but again same result.

    At this point I decided to use the test.pmwx file which you sent me, this time the printer recognised it and started to print. It was blindingly obvious that nothing was printing the crackle noise as the print releases from the FEP was conspicuously absent. I let it run for 15 minutes before cancelling the print and took the following pic after the build plate had retracked:

    IMG_1197.jpg

    You can clearly see the semi cured resin hanging from the middle of the build plate.

    I then set about filtering the resin which took a while because this stuff as well as me trapping some in the tank was also mixed with the resin in the filter paper.

    IMG_1198.jpg

    So obvious questions what was going on with Chiutu and Photon Workshop? I have Chitubox version 1.9.2 installed and Photon Workshop V2.1.29.RC12 installed.

    What do you think the cause of the semi cured goo might be?

    Best of luck

    Mossy
     
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  7. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Are you on mono x now?

    if so, I think the settings/exposure times will be different to the Mono? Is that right Paul?

    The below is what I have/had and then another Paul said the figures in red should be used..

    CB6A473D-3CA9-4186-AB0A-969FCBD37D1D.jpeg

    This gave a very good print first go for me although it’s a lot slower - note this is 0.05mm layer height.

    andy
     
  8. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Andy

    The test,pmwx body I tried to print was a copy of the test body provided by Anycubic, it wasn't anything created by Paul or myself.
    I don't know it settings but of all bodies I would have expected it to print correctly,

    Mossy
     
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  9. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Yes. Sorry, see what you mean. And I agree…. Did you reslice it?

    but these printers are dark magic. And as we have all seen we all have failures for reasons unknown that are never explained :facepalm:

    I take it with the x you have reduced the screen to 80%?:scratchchin:

    Your slicer will need completely different slicing settings for the two different machines (I say this not to you as such Mossy, but for anyone else reading the thread… screen sizes and lift speeds and the light on exposure times will differ)

    keep us posted… it may have just been too cold.. the settings I have posted above are what someone dialled in to be slightly slower to account for the fact my room is 20-21 deg not the 24-25 deg C that they hark on about in the US… no idea how Dundee does as must be Baltic up norf? :avatar:
    Andy
     
  10. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Morning Andy

    No it wasn't resliced, I simply took it as supplied exactly as you would do on an initial set up.
    Yes I had already reduced power to 80%.
    It wasn't too cold I successfully produced 3 prints on the mono the same day and I went through Mr Dundees warm the resin process just to make sure.
    I'm sure Mr Dundee is getting used to the far north, probably needs a w...y warm to keep his crown jewels active. :avatar:

    The results are exactly the same as about a dozen previous tests - frustration levels are now beyond :headbanger:

    Mossy
     
  11. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    I can imagine mate. :(
    Is the file from the mono or the mono x?

    to me, the mess is suggesting a lack of exposure time and not adhered on the initial layers.

    what did you get from the REIF print? The one where it prints 8 panels?
     
  12. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Andy

    The test file is from Paul and for the Mono X, as is the RERF file which I haven't tried.
    Can't do a fat lot more this weekend as I have run out of resin, and I am definitely not reusing the stuff I managed to filter from that goo. I could have sworn I had a litre bottle spare, there might be a secret resin drinker in this house, if so heaven help them.

    Mossty
     
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  13. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Sorry for the delay in responding, the boss had other plans for yesterday and today - something todo with our wedding anniversary ;)

    Looking from the pics as Andy says they appear under expossed, but they are at least curing, but not sticking to the plate.

    OK lets try this

    upload_2022-4-30_23-43-1.png

    I am emailing you a chitubox file of the above test_block_1 this one uses an exposure time for the bottom layers of 40s, and 3.3s for the rest of the layers.

    Were not really bothered about accuracy, just getting the wee so an so to stick.

    test_block_2 uses 50s for the base layers and test_block_3 uses 60s.

    4 files in the mail to (the forth is the chitubox project file to allow you to make changes.

    Paul
     
  14. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Mossy

    Thanks for sending the K class file to play with.

    I have printed the file via Chitubox in the vertical alignment using standard auto placement of heavy supports.

    Using my Eco resin - I'm trying to use the last of this stuff up, with the settings I've sent you before.

    Now a couple of caveats - this was printed overnight, without preheating the resin or the print room so temp was probably between 10 & 14 C (maybe less).



    As can be seen, there was a few failed supports but interestingly, due to the diagonal cross bracing the upper supports repaired them selves.

    A few of the lower supports had failed, but there was enough to hold the print in place.

    I know you dont want to print the floor, but I would suggest placing a strip to connect the sole bars and the body sides

    Layer 248 on the print

    upload_2022-5-1_11-10-23.png

    Layer 249

    upload_2022-5-1_11-11-6.png

    Layer 250

    upload_2022-5-1_11-12-1.png

    Although it is only a layer gap it does mean the chassis and body are only connected at the headstocks. Giving a potential failure point during a print, if the supports fail the the body and frames could divert especially when printing the model inclined.

    Also notice the right hand side on layer 250 there is a gap between the head stock and van sides, the gap is closed by layer 252

    upload_2022-5-1_11-18-48.png

    Another issue with the left hans side bracing, again a gap between the body on the bracing, the angle on the corners is ok but by layer 277 something has changed and there is a gap

    upload_2022-5-1_11-25-13.png

    There is also a gap in the door areas - where just like the prototype the doors are secured by the hinges, but this may give you issues.

    upload_2022-5-1_11-28-49.png

    Although this sounds a bit negative, it's meant to be, and once the print has dried - just had two ultrasonic cleans, a wash in soapy water and finally a wash in IPA - I will cut off the supports and take a closer look, but the model looks good, and feels sturdy, but I would say I am probably over curing the model with my settings.

    I will post up pics later

    Paul
     
  15. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Mossy

    Found a couple of faux pas on my placement of supports - now there's a suprise :facepalm: :avatar:

    The support at one corner wasn't near enough to the edge so the buffer beam tapers


    the other end was of - reminder to self - don't trust auto placement of the supports.


    Ref previous post, door looks secure enough


    Supports removed - I did damage one corner - 3 supports all coming together in the same region super glue fixed that .

    Minimal clean up done, so these are warts n all - actually more warts due to issue with the paint brush clogging up.



    Mossy the model looks really good.

    I don't think you will need to print it at 45/45

    Paul
     
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  16. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Evening Paul,

    Just got around to reading all your analysis and notes as in between setting up the shiny new Mono X we have had 2/3rd of our family plus 2 grandchildren aged 3 and 1 respectively most of the morning and early afternoon. The new beast was tested using the test file you sent me not the one supplied with the printer. As we would both have expected it worked perfectly, I only printed the first 1 1/2 hours worth of it before cancelling it and using one of the prints I sliced and tried on the duff printer, again it looks to be absolutely fine, but proof in the eating will come at 7:30 tonight.

    So back to your analysis, the gaps between the end and sides definitely need investigation they shouldn't be there. The horizontal gap between the side doors and ramp again need looking at, studying the two test prints there's a definite bow shape to the bottom of the side doors. On to your worry about a lack of support between the sides and chassis. Many of the NER wagons I have printed have this gap and I have never had a problem with the prints separating. Rather than heavy supports I use (probably to many) mediums on both the chassis and side, a method which hasn't failed me yet. I'm glad you like the model so after resolving the various problems you highlighted I thionk a further test shot will be neccessary.

    Thanks for you time and effort.

    Mossy
     
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  17. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    don’t worry.. we have all been there and made similar mistakes.
    Even my latest model when split down suddenly revealed at the last moment two parts intersecting rather than meeting. quick edit and sorted..

    Latest file out this morning.

    E2B57919-CD0C-48C2-A2B1-C39A7F8EBD2E.jpeg
     
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  18. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Just spotted this on farcebook

    82FB1120-095B-4199-8D4D-D5F779369A6F.jpeg

    I wondered if mossy had the newer one?
     
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  19. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Hi Andy

    Where did you find that little gem? I could do with following it.
    Sorry haven't a clue how old the beast is roughly 6 months was shown an invoice 6 months old and it doesn't look any older, replacement screen 2-3 weeks.
    Interestingly connection from mono plate to printer was different. Old one (I still have) one unit, new one has two pieces and matched exactly the anycubic video of how to replace a mono plate.

    Mossy
     
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  20. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Facebook - I’m in the group. Although posted 17hrs earlier, I spotted it moments after reading your post… and just thought… Hmm. Although I didn’t know yours wasn’t new. So may not be applicable..

    but, worth a look. Have you wound down the screen to 80% when it maybe should be still 100% ?
    (I have read of some running theirs at 60%)

    andy
     

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