Mossys 3D Models

Discussion in 'Workshop Benches' started by Mossy, May 19, 2022.

  1. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Paul

    It sounds like we both are having problems. I went back to an earlier version of the autocar, and reapplied the changes, through Chitu supported sliced, so I knew everything had been changed. Warmed up the X2 and fired up a print, my 2 hour check - exactly the same problem, ^&*(*%$, yes the air was blue, especially since sitting on my desk in an early print of the body, created without any problems, except the bits I had missed off. No idea why so I am going for a total strip down today. Then print a different body that I know works just to eliminate the printer from the problems probably use the 5 squares test if I can find it!
     
  2. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    The initial base layeyrs were stuck to the build plate, but the rafts had started to delaminate, now these would have been after the extended base layer cure times.

    I've releveled the build plate because of the damage to the fep, just incase any thing moved.

    I'm wondering if the ambient temp of the print chamber is causing the issue. As the build plate is out of the resin, it will cool down, the first layers were cured to the build plate at 10x the exposure of the non-base layers, so firmly attached, just wondering if as the plate cools and contracts its causing the layers to split along the junction between base and normal layers. The prints above seem to be exposed correctly.

    For my next print, I will try not pre-warming the build plate.

    Probably be tomorrow before I can get back in the shed.

    Paul
     
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  3. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Got to say, I know your printing in a cool shed, but that is the first time I’ve come across anyone heating the build plate? Never seen that in any of the Facebook forums!

    is this a new thing your trying Paul? Or has it previously been successful for you?

    on an aside. Guy posted this am that he had fails due to an over tensioned fep.. he’s got years of experience (so he said) but didn’t know how to solve the issue…

    he seemed a little taken aback when I said change the fep! I think he was wanting some kind of solution to stretch the fep even more so it wasn’t too tight any more.. can’t help some folk.. (yet he knew loosening it would also not help)
     
  4. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Andy

    I've been preheating the build plate as part of the warm up process, and uptill now has worked well since moving the printers into the shed.
    However that was when the ambient temp was approx 15C, not the 5C we have had over the last week.
    I immesed the build plate in water approx 30C, after 5 to 10 mins the plate would be about 27C, the resin in the bottles sitting the the water would have heated to approx 20C.
    When the resin was added to the vat, and the build plate dried off and refitted. The build plate would be lowered to the home position left for a min or two to allow the heat to equalise. Giving a start temp around 22C..

    At the moment I'm clutching at straws, but hopefully will get into the shed in the morning and fit a new fep. Forcasted temps tomorrow are 7 to 10C during the day dropping to 3C overnight.

    My additional 300mm tube heaters have arrived, hopefully they can maintain the print enclosure to arround 14C, whgich is the temp the man cave would drop down too at night when the heating goes off.

    Fingers crossed.

    Paul
     
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  5. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Andy.

    I use the same process and Paul. I think, Paul will correct me if I'm wrong, he put me on to it but was only warming the resin, I started warming both resin and build plate and he picked up on it. I use bath hot water and boiling water in a roughly 2:1 mix, and again sink the dried build plate into the resin for 5-10 mins before firing up a print. It works a treat.

    Mossy
     
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  6. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Yep as Mossy put it.

    New Fep fitted, I've added a fan heater to the enclosure, everything now over 22C, wish there was more room in the enclosure as the rest of the shed is not warm :whatever:

    Started the print at approx 9am, I will check on the progress in a few hours, the Boss has activities, so I have jobs to be done :( :avatar:

    Nae rest for the wicked - just can't remember what I did and if I enjoyed it at the time.

    Paul
     
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  7. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    5 hours in and is looking ok from what I can see.

    Fingers crossed

    Paul
     
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  8. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Checked again at 9pm - 12hrs done, 15hrs to go, and still looking good.

    Also did my first test print of the Sheep wagon body parts, first impression looked good enough to install the spare build plate and try for a second one.

    Will clean it and remove the supports tomorrow - one of the disadvantages of the stuff being in the shed.

    Paul
     
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  9. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    The chassis is still looking good


    4 hours to go


    Paul
     
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  10. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    I wish I could figure out what's going wrong with mine, I ran a test with a wagon that I have printed multiple times, same failure. The only thing I can come up with and bizarre is temperature. All the successful prints were done in the summer using the old preheating by dunking in hot water not using the thermal heating band, so this afternoon I am going back to the old way of doing it with hot water pre-heating.
     
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  11. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    27 hours and 50 mins later print completed at the third attempt :facepalm:

    I'd say the biggest change was the ambient temp of the enclosure - I used a fan heater within the enclosure this kept the ambient temp to between 22 and 30 C.
    After my visit this morning I forgot to replace the printer cover, which had loosened the supports directly infront of the heater - It was very close. Fortunately there was enough ridgidity in the print to carry on without issue.

    The only other issue is with the footboards - they are not joined to the chassis all the way along, which made them vulnerable during handling and support removal, with a section breaking off on one side and a couple cracking.

    Currently curing so will post pics up later.

    Paul
     
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  12. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Hi yes they aren't supported all the way along they sit on mounting plates which are .35mm thick. When I was printing the body/chassis as a composite I ran a line of light supports along the outside edge to hold them in place. I don't think that would be feasible with a huge incline line your print I think the light support would fail. Sorry I should have warned you about this before you started printing. My latest test failed miserably so I am completely at a loss what the ...... to do next.
     
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  13. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Mossy speaks with a forked tongue, they sit on little triangular supports and are off set by .35mm.

    Footboards.png
     
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  14. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Ok so heres a few pics

    Chassis


    Chassis and roof


    And the damaged bit


    I'll get these wrapped and sent and you can decide on whats next.

    Printer is resting / cooling down :avatar:

    Paul
     
  15. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Paul,

    Your a gent, did I supply you with enough resin or do I need to order up some more for you? What's next is for me to print the ^&*(% bodies and get the thing built. I hope you have learned a few things about your new toy that will come in useful later down the way. My next task is to get back to my Class A loco, but some time next year I have 3 other coaches with the designs almost finished, if you fancy more chassis/roof jobs. :facepalm: They are smaller than the autocoach, built on 49ft chasses not 52ft, so saving the printer 21mm, what's that, a whopping saving of about an hour? :avatar:

    Mossy
     
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  16. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Paul asked what's next well. For some reason I woke up at my old working get up time of 4:15 this morning so I have had plenty of time to think on how to progress the autocoach body after over a week of failures. The new plan is to use my trusty old Mono, which hopefully hasn't got the same problems as the X2 (time will tell). Printing a left and right half of the body isn't possible the build plate isn't big enough, but it is big enough to do the print in 3 sections, left, right and middle and amazingly it does allow a different strategy. The old way meant the join ran directly through the middle of the panelling and would required an awkward clean up and fill job. The new way I can slice up the body into 3 directly through the door cuts so any clean up will be in one plane rather than two. I think I talked this through with Rob on a different print about 18 months ago but forgot about it. The second advantage is I can fit the two end section to the chassis first and then do each middle section separately meaning I am not juggling one side against the other. All good plans etc, fingers crossed.

    It proved remarkably simple to chop the body in to three, which actually gives 4 bodies, left, right and 2 middles. Three print runs of about 4hr 15mins a 50% increase but after all the lost time what 4 and a bit hours, so they are now sliced and diced in Chitu and ready to print, wish me luck. These are the 4 bodies, the thin line visible on the middle section is where the old join would be.

    3 way slice.jpg
     
  17. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Check the tension of the fep??
    Other than screen failure, that seems to be one of the most common issues. I can only think the fans running within must loosen the screws on the vat.
     
  18. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Andy - The Fep stretches over time, and not always the same in all directions. One reason not to fully tighten the screws when fitting new, to allow further tensioning.

    Mossy are you wanting another print of the chassis, or see the current prints and see if theyre workable ?

    Paul
     
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  19. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Must admit i'm impressed with the results, not sure if I will go as big, but may try some 6 wheeled stock.

    Paul
     
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  20. Mossy

    Mossy A classic grump Yorkshire man Full Member

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    Having chopped up the body into 4 bodies, I dug out my old Photon Mono to do the prints, blow me it refused to read the memory stick, so I tried a different one, same result. Tests with 3 more memory stick all failed, conclusion the old mono isn't a happy bunny. That left my recent purchase of a Mono 2, I haven't been happy with this simply because Chitu doesn't support it, I hate Fusion Workshop and detest the complexities of Lychee all un-necessary, which left me a big problem.

    Experiment time, use Chitu to support the model using the Mono profile (wrong size, bits hang over the sides, will it work), then save as a .stl file, open up fusion workshop, import the .stl and get it orientated correctly, slice and blow me that bit worked, but what does the printer make of it? The printer chunter away for 3 1/2 hours and we have a print, sadly a few supports failed (mea culpa), so a quick rebuild and a new print. I'm a happy bunny, a really nice detailed print of 1/3rd of a coach and a way around thigs till I figure out what's wrong with the X2. Piccie to follow if/when the sun gets around to my photography post.
     
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