My DCC Journey

Discussion in 'DCC Control' started by Tallpaul70, Mar 15, 2019.

  1. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Paul
    The high current draw may be down to the magnets loosing thier magnetisim.
    There are replacement motors kits available for the Lima Ringfield motor based loco's.

    Lima Railcar Motor Replacement Kit

    I have one for my Lima O gauge 4F - but still need to fit it. However users who have fitted the replacement motors give very favourable reviews, and reckon the loco's are really smooth runners after the conversion.

    As Tom has stated the Heljan's do have higher current usage, but will be within the current restraints of the decoder. My Heljan DPU & Cl 26 both use 0.1A for the lights, and approx 0.4A for the loco and lights. My sound fitted Bachmann Cl 24 (ESU V4) draws approx 0.3A with lights, sound and 3 coaches behind it.

    Hope this helps

    Paul
     
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  2. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    And I've found a video to go with it



    Paul
     
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  3. Splitpin

    Splitpin Full Member

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    There is a Dapol Parcels one on the way June/July. I bought a Passenger version some months ago. It's fitted with a Zimo 'YouChoos' sound chip and I couldn't more than recommend it. It also copes with #2 radius curves no problem, something my old (now retired) Lima version was never happy with.
     
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  4. Sol

    Sol Full Member

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    I would keep both DC & DCC electrically separated at the outputs- just switching off mains power is not enough - I have seen what happens to a NCE Powercab when DC got onto the output of the NCE controller - not nice...
     
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  5. Toto

    Toto I'm best ignored Staff Member Founder Administrator

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    Some good advice there I think. I'd be a bit edgy about mixing the two as well. Keep them well isolated unless you have deep pockets.
     
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  6. Tallpaul70

    Tallpaul70 Full Member

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    Trouble with switches is there is nowhere to mount it without quite a lot of work. This is a temporary testing and DCC set up track and has no control panel! Only way I can see is to find a small plastic box , mount the switch on one side and sockets for the three sets of cables (one input, two outputs on the other and then put appropriate plugs on the three leads.
    Anyone got a suggestion involving less work?
    May have to put up with continuing to unplug the lead to the tracks from the back of my NCE control box!

    Many thanks
    Best regards
    Paul
     
  7. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Then maybe use a Deans connector (male end wires connected to the track), and a female connector on the output from the DCC and another on the DC output, you then just connect the power source in use to the track. By having the female end on the power source, it won't short out if you forget to turn the power off.

    Paul.
     
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  8. Tallpaul70

    Tallpaul70 Full Member

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    Hi All,
    It is over 3 months since my last update, apologies for the long silence!

    Thanks to Sol and Paul_I for their input on the separation of DC and DCC. I have for the moment just gone for the simple solution of trying not to change from one to the other too often, but making sure everything is appropriately isolated!

    Currently working on chipping locos, and finalizing layout plan.
    Since starting on sound chip fitting I have concluded that I will sound fit more locos than I first thought which increases the cost.
    So I am looking at using the Hornby TTS rather than £100 sound chips in a number of locos that they were not originally aimed for, such as fitting them to other manufacturers locos and to different types of loco than they were designated for.

    There are some nonos in this.
    Not a good idea to fit 2 cylinder sound in three cylinder locos or Great Western loco chips in other company locos (or vise versa!!).

    I have managed to find some Hornby chassis for my Lima bodies although sometimes I have had to buy a whole loco, but some liveries are quite cheap.
    Picking up on Splitpin's comment in May, I needed the "angular" GWR parcels car No 34, not the earlier version No 17.

    I have also replaced a couple of Hornby and Bachmann locos that were not capable of being chipped with more modern versions of them that are capable of being chipped.

    There are two things I would appreciate info on:-
    1) Did Lima fit the 5 pole motor from their 00 class 67 to any other UK outline 00 loco?
    2) Is there any Hornby TTS diesel loco chip that sounds right in an 00 first or second generation DMU?

    I will try to keep you informed of how I am getting on.
    I will aim not to be too ambitious in this after failing to keep info flowing in the past. So I hope to do a monthly update.

    Best regards
    Paul
     
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  9. Davoetype

    Davoetype Full Member

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    As far as the DC and DCC inputs are concerned, the cleanest and safest method is to have a single input to the track connected to a double pole double throw switch from the DC and DCC inputs. This will avoid the inevitable situation when you inadvertently have both power sources active. The NCE system will not like this!

    Cheers

    and happy modelling

    Richard
     
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  10. Tallpaul70

    Tallpaul70 Full Member

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    Hi All,
    Well technically it is still October, so it is only some 6 weeks since my last update, but doing one every 4 weeks or so is harder than it sounds!

    So where am I now?
    Chipping of locos is proceeding steadily and with more TTS chips coming out I have more variety in my locos:-
    I have britannia chips in a Britannia, and also in a 73xxx. The J36 chip has gone into an Ivatt small 2-6-0 (465xx) and a 76xxx standard.

    I have found someone to chip my Lima diesels and am awaiting the return of the first batch. Chipping HSTs has involved replacing the motors, and fitting pickups to the dummy cars, so I will tell you about the results next time.
    I also have found some Loksound 3.5s and am awaiting their fitment into appropriate Diesels and multiple units.

    Having about bottomed out the model track layout I am working on the signaling plan which is colour lights for the mainline and semaphores for the branch. Strictly this dates the layout to post the WR mainline 1963 resignalling, whereas I am timing it as mid 1962. However this compromise makes it possible to run the 1992 version of the layout with just the semaphores changed for colour lights.

    I am investigating computerizing the layout via a Roco Z21 and I train on a old iPhone with a mimic diagram on an older Ipad.

    I am also investigating the Soundtraxx modules as a way to chip some locos not available via TTS.

    So lots to update you on in the November posting!

    Happy modelling
    Regards
    Paul
     
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  11. Tallpaul70

    Tallpaul70 Full Member

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    Hi All,
    Apologies for the time that has elapsed since my last update, but judging from the deathly silence that has greeted my last post, I am largely talking to myself so I don't think it matters much. (Thanks to the couple of you, Andy and Jakesdad, who bothered to like my previous post!)

    This being the case, I am thinking that I will save myself some time and not do any further updates.

    Clearly my modelling problems and successes are of little interest to members of the forum, or not sufficient interest to be worth commenting on!

    I have plenty to occupy me on the modelling front so I think I will limit myself to contributing to others threads that I find of interest and asking the occasional question on a particular point I need information on.

    Best regards
    Paul
     
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  12. Tallpaul70

    Tallpaul70 Full Member

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    OK,
    Lets try turning some of my comments into questions and see what happens?

    1) Is it sensible to have maintenance/re motor/chipping of my Lima locos and units? As my layout will be code 100 track I intend keeping the current wheels. Will this work?

    2) I am debating whether to change the "modern" version of my layout from running c2007 to c2016. The original decision was made some 10 years ago in 2009. However I really like the new 800 series sets and the new GWR livery. This means some of my locos and units bought over the last ten years or so are in liveries that are not suited to 2016 running. Is it worth the cost of respraying? (spray painting is not one of my skills!).

    3) What are peoples experience of putting loco TTS chips into DMUs (Not HSTs!)? A video of a class 31 TTS in a class 105 DMU, sounded reasonable. Is the difference between seamless sound of a loco with electric transmission and the gear changes of the DMU is very noticeable or an acceptable compromise given that my layout will not have a station so the DMUs will mainly pass through and would not have needed to do gear changes?

    Any comments or advice on the above would be welcolme, particularly other peoples experiences in these areas?

    Cheers
    Paul
     
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  13. York Paul

    York Paul Staff Member Moderator

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    Hello Tallpaul70,

    It is disappointing to note you feel need to vent frustrations publicly but I too post much that doesn't ever get replied to either, however with 657 views recorded I'd say your thread is quite a popular one and most likely members have not responded to your previous post in the numbers that you had hoped for because these members feel they have not really anything to add which will be of help to you. What I can say is please refer to Rule 2 in the Rules to Play By section found in the Introduction, what I would ask of you in this instance is to please consider how other members may feel reading your words and thinking such a rant could well be aimed at them... that is not fair play so I ask you in this instance to be more tolerant if you encounter silence, it is not a personal thing against you, your interest or your modeling projects... the silence just happens at certain times as I'm sure you'll agree with.

    Regards York Paul (Moderator)
     
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  14. York Paul

    York Paul Staff Member Moderator

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    Paul to offer a response to your last question ( taking into account my previous post) I am not able to offer advice on matters DCC and the fact that I model in 7mm which has a different set of parameters altogether. My only advice would be to run the stock which you enjoy having in your collection. The knock on cost issue for modelers in following the privatised railway scene is how quickly livery styles alter, that doesn't mean you need to sell on your stock because it runs out time chronologically or has just become obsolete for the period you model in... a costly upkeep I'd say otherwise and certainly not worth respraying if that is not your forte. I'm sure others here will offer answers with better authority than I but this is the best I can do.
     
  15. Toto

    Toto I'm best ignored Staff Member Founder Administrator

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    You maybe could check the flange depths of your Lima wheel sets but I'd imagine they will run fine on code100 track. I know Gormo runs Lima on his very successfully ..... so go for it. :thumbs:

    Re your reference to lack of interest, I think you'll find there are relatively quiet periods at times. However , going into winter you should notice a marked change in forum traffic as folks revert back to a hobby which can be done indoors. That has been my experience. I'm not sure how much you engage on other threads but I find building up a bit of mutual interest usually goes a long way.

    Again, my own experience is that once you start to hit it off with other members who maybe share the same interests in the hobby, your own interaction will thrive.

    DCC in particular is a very interesting element of the hobby ( at least in my book ) give it a little time.

    Most of all enjoy.

    Toto
     
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  16. Sol

    Sol Full Member

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    Paul, while I read most posts, I add a comment if I think it will help.

    Now Point 1. with Code 100, leave wheels as they are - saves money

    Point 2. your railway - do what you like - my D&S runs stock from 1930- 1999 and many different diesel colours - the D&S is an operating layout, not one that represents a specific point in time.

    Point 3- sound - not my cup of tea, try being in a room 12 x 20ft with 5 or more locos making sound and concentrating on shunting specific wagons to specific locations !! I have heard some sound locos many feet away from the driver, IMO sound should be only heard a couple of feet away as one follows the train around the layout.
     
  17. paul_l

    paul_l Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Paul

    Answering your questions in reverse order (as this is a DCC thread)

    As far as I know / remember a class 31 doesn't sound like a DMU, but if remembering rule 1 - it's your layout, and what you want goes. I have bought an TTS A3 decoder to fit into a V2 (if I ever get round to completeing the conversion). DMU's kind of scare me as I have several Bachmann 105 & 108's all needing a chip in each coach :hammer:.

    As getting a respray can often cost more than buying new / second hand, I'd try to develop your spraying skills. Maybe trying with some wagons first, and if you use Acrylic paints, these can be easily removed to get the crash test dummy ready for another go.

    With the Lima's, if you intend to keep them, then for the price they are worth re-motoring, however if you intend to change from code 100 track, then they will need re-wheeling. Drop in wheel sets are available, but not cheap.

    Paul
     
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  18. Tallpaul70

    Tallpaul70 Full Member

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    Thanks to Sol and Paul_i for their contributions.

    I have just had a TTS P type chip put into an A2 Blue Peter. Haven't had chance to run it yet, I will let you know how it goes. I think there is a lot of "keeping up with the Jones" with chips. I was listening to a couple of CDs yesterday of preserved steam and I couldn't distinguish between many of the types of the same size. Whistles can be a telling factor, so I would not put an LMS chip in a GWR loco or a LNER one. But I am encouraged to continue putting chips in locos other than their intended type!

    I also agree that sounds played at high volume are a pain. While I might not tell the differences between types, any distortion soon gets to me!

    Cheers
    Paul
     
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  19. AJS is a Red

    AJS is a Red Full Member

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    Hi Paul.

    I'm in the group York Paul mentioned - I'm modelling in DC, hence not replying to your thread as I cannot offer any DCC advice. However, I have been dipping in and out of your thread with interest as I plan to switch to DCC in the future, so I plan to follow replies as it may help me in the future.

    Andrew.
     
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  20. Keith M

    Keith M Staff Member Moderator

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    I would agree with Paul-L with regard to respraying. If you don't have a go, then you never will master paint spraying. I use a cheap (£10 Draper) airbrush, no need to go 'over-the-top' on the pricey models, at least not to start with, and when spraying primer, I use the acrylic car paint 'Rattle cans' from our local 'cheap shop' (£2.99 each!) so no breaking the bank there! I admit I have a 'proper' airbrush compressor, but there are other much cheaper ways to progress, and as Paul again say's, try it out on a cheapo wagon or similar (plenty available in local 'Toy & Train fairs'), my advice to begin with would be to stick to acrylic paints which are water based so no evil smells and the airbrush can be cleaned by just 66% to 33% water to isopropyl alcohol solution, much less messy and there are plenty of paint brands and colour to choose from, my preference being the "Railmatch" brand, but others are available. When I restarted in this hobby some 6 years ago, I hadn't been near model railways since I was about 12 (which is over 60 years ago!), knew zilch about spray painting, how models had changed in the interim, DCC or much else, how 'deep' you want to go is up to the individual, but at my age, I intend to keep learning, keep my brain busy (hopefully to keep Altsheimers/Dementia at bay!) and just have a bash at any new technique that takes my fancy, as I take the view that if you don't try, you'll never know if you may find you are better at things than you might expect! Lima stuff has mostly the "Pizza-Cutter" type wheels, Alan Gibson do wheelsets suitable for Lima DMU/EMU's at £1.70 each, as they are narrower than standard wheelsets.
    Regarding DCC, I've now converted well over 100 loco's to DCC, both sound and non-sound including the dreaded "Split Chassis Bachmanns", so although I certainly don't consider myself an "EXPERT" (Ex is something that has-been, and "Spurt" is a drip under pressure!) I feel that I should be able to help or advise if you are in any way stuck with DCC. Please don't be 'miffed' if you feel that no-one is paying attention to your thread, I've posted many threads on "How-To's" and such, but don't expect many to be of interest to all members, after all, they may not model my gauge/region/railway company/era etc, but it doesn't and won't stop me from continuing to post likewise in the future, and I'm not in the business of trying to get to the top of the "Likes" table, I just want to help and possibly advise others, though I'm not above asking for help myself, as no-one "Knows-it-all". Enjoy the hobby and keep an open mind, best regards,
    Keith.
     

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