Airfix 14xx 0-4-2t loco

Discussion in 'DCC Control' started by Andy_Sollis, Apr 15, 2022.

  1. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Help!!

    can anyone advise on converting one of these older locos to DCC. My lad is mad on them and we recently aquired an almost new one (despite being nearly 40 year old) at a swap meet, but on stripping down, it’s got no wiring whatsoever. It’s a similar to the split chassis design. I have bags of room to fit the decoder, but can’t fathom how it works or where would be best to isolate to fit the 4 wires?

    has anyone done one?
     
  2. Jim Freight

    Jim Freight Full Member

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    Hi Andy, I have one of these to potentially convert however 4-4-0 and 0-4-4 locos I have converted so far e.g. Tri-ang have always been a problem because unlike the prototype they are very poorly balanced resulting in poor traction and pickup weight.

    Even when I bought one of those (Airfix) new when they first came out reliable running was very difficult as power pickup was restricted, I think at least one or two treads have tyres which makes power pickup worse. I only attained decent running on DC by fitting extra power pickups in an attached autocoach.

    So as far as DCC is concerned the Airfix version will need extra pickups in an adjacent vehicle to make a usable model, this model rates very low in the "Is it worth it" league, I think DJ models brought one out a few years ago which had no tyres and all wheel pickup but will obviously cost somewhat more.

    Jim
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2022
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  3. Walkingthedog

    Walkingthedog Full Member

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    The two halves of the chassis are isolated from each other. A friend DCC'd his by insulating the motor from the chassis then attached wires to each side of the chassis to the decoder then wires to the motor. It ran dreadfully as did my Airfix version on DC. I replaced the wheels with tyres with ordinary wheels, still hopeless. The DJ version is well worth looking out for. Almost new mint condition versions are fairly easy to obtain because they don’t run well.
     
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  4. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Ah thanks..

    Any idea how to insulate? I can’t work out where?
     
  5. Walkingthedog

    Walkingthedog Full Member

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  6. Jim Freight

    Jim Freight Full Member

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    Looking at the service sheet Brian shows above.

    From the diagram it looks like parts 80095-4 and 80090-9 are the parts that make the electrical connection between wheels and motor.

    I would suggest Andy that you insulate those with pieces of paper initially and check with a multi-meter that they do isolate the motor, if so insert something more durable.

    But please remember what Brian and I have found, even on DC they are poor runners, on DCC they will be worse.

    Jim
     
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  7. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    It has been noted..

    this one does run well on DC when we have tried it. So I’m hopeful.
    If it doesn’t, lado can have a rethink what he wants and we will swap it if it’s no good..

    great idea re insulating. I need to sit down with it and have a good hour on it..

    Best ideas for tapping in to the chassis block for the other connections? Or just cut the tabs back and solder to them and the other 2 wires to the brush bezels on the motor?

    thanks again!

    andy
     
  8. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Incidentally, I have heard that some of the poor running was down to the plunger pickups in the chassis.
     
  9. Jim Freight

    Jim Freight Full Member

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    Well if you get yours running well I would be interested know how before I try and convert mine to DCC running, Jim
     
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  10. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    I’ll keep you posted! :thumbs:
     
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  11. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    So, as Jim suggested, the two parts listed do indeed carry power to the motor. But it also looks like the screw to secure the motor to the chassis may also be conducting power.
    So, I need to see how that can be insulated. (It’s may not be the screw but infact the motor sitting on the live chassis)

    Also then to see how I secure the feed to the bottom brass contact strip. (As in where I route my decoder wires) May need to mod the pin the spring went on to ensure that’s isolated too. May take the motor lead off this and cover in shrink insulation.

    and finally, how to tap in to the chassis block to take a feed off there. Motor end is easy.

    few photos of the strip down. Amazed how fresh it still looks.

    677EB3A3-8AB1-4056-9C6F-D565B6FB820B.jpeg
    the five pole motor. 09B32E79-EF5D-4B48-944A-361ED46C8663.jpeg
    Chassis with the bottom plastic keeper in place. You can see where the lower brass contact is that the spring sits on. 71D17F19-2609-4859-A551-1CC9CD578AA2.jpeg
    Totally stripped

    gone back together for now. Need to sit and have a think

    andy
     
  12. Walkingthedog

    Walkingthedog Full Member

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    You could replace the metal screw with a nylon version
     
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  13. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    I have no idea what thread I’d need or where to source? may be as easy to try and insulate this one?

    Time will tell..

    Anyone know where to get them from? Not something I’ve ever purchased?
     
  14. Walkingthedog

    Walkingthedog Full Member

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    Need to find out what thread it is from the metal one. I only mentioned it because nylon screws are used to insulate some Ringfield motors when DCCing them.
     
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  15. Walkingthedog

    Walkingthedog Full Member

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    I read that it is a good idea to turn the motor upside down.

    Seems to be lots of info on line.
     
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  16. Jim Freight

    Jim Freight Full Member

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    I can see why power pickup could be a problem.

    Tyres are fitted to the centre axle, which to grip well the chassis may see-saw on that axle, however that means what you gain in grip is at the expense of power pickup, do one set of plungers go to the small non-drivers?
     
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  17. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    Hi Jim,
    There are plunger pickups to all 6 wheels, which I feel is a little daft considering the traction tyres as you say. It’s only going to be of any use if as already suggested the middle wheel set is removed for a plain wheel. I need to look at these and see if they are groved to accept the tyres (suspect they are) and if it’s of use to remove them. It’s not like there will be much of a load on its drawbar.
     
  18. Andy_Sollis

    Andy_Sollis Staff Member Moderator

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    No securing screw hole on the opposite side.. which may be of benefit with the nylon screw as can re-tap to what size you need.. hmm I’ll have a think about that. Not that I have any taps and dies, the father in law does, but not sure he goes that fine?
     
  19. Jim Freight

    Jim Freight Full Member

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    I suppose even with tyres the flanges will occasionally touch the rails, seems like a desperate measure or they changed the design from tyreless when without tyres it could not pull anything.

    Another option to tapping a hole is to use fine self tapping screws, Jim
     
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  20. Jim Freight

    Jim Freight Full Member

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    And sometimes the threads are not quite compatible but the screw thread distorts enough to hold, was the case when I bought some to DCC a Hornby Ringfield mechanism, Jim
     
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